Forum:Curse

I have contacted Curse about moving off of Wikia and onto their hosting site. Normally, Curse only hosts gaming wikis, such as World of Warcraft, Minecraft, Terraria Wiki, and Skyrim. When I contacted them, they had mentioned that they have their own Pokémon site Marriland. If we were to go through with this, we would be added onto the marriland domain and we'd become the wiki associated with Marriland. There are forums, the Pokémon site, and Oekaki. Much like pokemon.marriland, we'd be wiki.marriland. Curse will support the anime, the card game, and the manga, not just the games.

Personally, I feel this would be the best move for the wiki. We're supposed to be a Pokémon Encyclopedia, not a social networking site. With this PlayQuiz thing, Chat, Badges and blogs (which we've disabled), top 10 lists, and message wall we're becoming a social networking site, not an encyclopedia. When I signed up for Wikia, I signed up to help form content, if I thought it'd be another social networking site in two years, I wouldn't have made my account.

Basically, what I'm say is this is going to be a very big decision to make. I do not expect voting to happen any time soon, I'm hoping we'll talk to the Curse staff in a skype group or something before we even start the voting. We need to have quite a large discussion first before we even think about voting.

There are some things to consider, if we move, we'll have two Pokémon Wikis to compete against. It might be hard for us to build up a community, but it'll be easy since Marriland has a community. I don't think this will have a negative impact, I feel it will have a highly positive impact. Jazzi 00:06, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * If this is becoming more like a social networking site, then the answer is simple: try to cut out what you think is unencyclopediac, if you can. I mean, all of these features can easily be disabled.  The only question is who you want to leave in charge (since not everyone is going with you) when you move.  And I'm certainly not doing it, because I have wikis that I myself am admin of.  --Thenewguy34( Other) 00:28, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * The point is Wikia is straying to far from what an encyclopedia is. And no, these features cannot easily be disabled. PlayQuiz can only be viewed by staff. And what we need disabled is already disabled, with the exception of chat. And it'll be discussed among the admins who will become an admin when we move. I'm not just an admin here, I'm an admin in multiple other places, I still plan on editing on those wikis. But those are wikis that are firm in the stance of not moving and/or cannot move to curse. And do you think we haven't tried cutting out what is turning us into a social networking site, we have badges disabled, as well as blogs. We opted out of enabling Message Wall, and I'm surprised Chat is still enabled. Jazzi  00:35, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * Welcome to Facebook. Let's be friends! 8-] Moving off Wikia sounds nice; it gives us a chance to clean up articles (not to be... rude, but some of the content here don't even make sense), create a better template structure - make a fresh start in general. But one thing that was mentioned above is that we'll definitely have competition. Plus, there's going to be a lot of work putting up articles, from the hundreds of items and Pokémon to locations and characters. But hey, that's not a problem if we take it step by step, working on one part. As for the current state of Wikia, the social networking Wikia is trying to implement concerns me. I wouldn't be surprised if they added friends list. Currently, my input about moving off Wikia would be around 60% for the move. And a similar topic was brought up about moving away from Wikia last year. Lots of good points Jazzi brought up on it. But hey, what's in the past stays in the past; any new points to bring up, I'm all ears/eyes.


 * As I mentioned with Jazzi beforehand, at the moment I do agree with this move to Curse. Wikia's recent developments have gone too far with this recent PlayQuiz. I mean, it starts with doing the little things without a proper consensus, and then suddenly, we are forced to accept the most ridiculous changes, but this isn't a rant on how much Wikia fails. If we do make our move to Curse, which most likely will be favorable, I do wonder what cosmetic or technical changes the wiki will undergo. I also do hope, as Bermuda mentioned above about a fresh start, in my opinion that would be ideal. It would allow us to build up article standards and yes allow us to organize our content well while making remaking it. &mdash; Wattz  2000  02:05, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * As for rights, the content would still be under the CC-BY-SA Creative Commons license just like at Wikia, and managed by you and your admins. And we think it would be best for it to be hosted be under the Marriland domain, as this would help bring new users to the wiki thanks to its thriving Pokemon community.

As for the skin, Curse currently supports only Vector. You'll be free to edit the CSS and JS files, and we can help you customize the wiki's looks if needed.

As for covering the card game, anime etc, while Curse generally focuses on video games, we certainly don't mind the wiki covering the rest of the Pokemon franchise as well.
 * Jazzi 02:20, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * I haven't been on Wikia that long, but I do agree that all the new features on Wikia are way too social for an encyclopedia. Honestly, most people now just go on Wikia for chat or to make random blogs. I'm all for moving to Curse right now, and I'm interested as to how it'll affect the wiki.


 * I'd be supportive of the move, the fact that we could have the support of a well established community is a big plus. In my opinion, Wikia has lost its way, it used to be about content, now all they seem to care about is money and competing with social sites. Every since they forced the skin change, they have been money-centric. I applaud them for bringing new features, but these new features are stifling content focused wikis, like us. So, I'd like to see how this would effect the wiki, it could go either way, we could not survive or we could thrive on Marriland.  13:33, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * That's good news. I support the move to Curse. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) 18:58, June 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm going to open up a skype group so that we can discuss the move. I'd appreciate it if all of us were to participate, my skype is enemypeacemaker. Jazzi  14:54, June 13, 2012 (UTC)


 * Just a note, the best moment to leave Wikia is before Black and White 2 are released, so people start adding content on the new wiki instead of here, so visitors would go to the new wiki instead of here and this site won't be competing with the new wiki for this new content. --Ciencia Al Poder (talk) 19:14, June 14, 2012 (UTC)


 * Adding people into the group now. Is there a skype name I can reach you at, Ciencia? Jazzi  19:55, June 15, 2012 (UTC)


 * Added the people who I know have skype names to the group. Please add me if you'd like me to add you in. Jazzi  11:59, June 16, 2012 (UTC)


 * While I cannot attend the meeting, I would like to say that I'm very supportive of this move. Anything that will be discussed, such as where to start (like working on B2W2 and forming the community), fill me in! :)
 * I'll probably "take notes" in a word.doc and post the main points in this forum. Jazzi  12:52, June 17, 2012 (UTC)
 * Though I've just returned, I support a move. -- 01:59, June 20, 2012 (UTC)


 * I don't want to sound rash, but any news on the move? B2W2 are released in Japan as we speak, and a lot of stuff are already being added.

[6/21/2012 11:32:24 PM] Sabrina M.: Possible idea on when we might move? [6/21/2012 11:34:09 PM] Cameron/KPZSR1: I have none, Ryushu hasn't shown up for days.. [6/21/2012 11:35:53 PM] Devin Peltier-Robson: I would guess somewhere in the 1-2 month range. Maybe 3 with the design and such. There's still a lot of stuff going on in the transition of Marriland.com, but I don't see a need to hold off the migration and integration of the Wiki until after the entire site is completely redesigned. [6/21/2012 11:36:54 PM] Devin Peltier-Robson: Now, keep in mind this is just a guess; we'll have a better idea once the development and design team can give us some clear numbers, but I think that's what we were expecting for migrating the Marriland Forums as well as the server hosting for the site. [6/21/2012 11:37:12 PM] Sabrina M.: Ah, okay [6/21/2012 11:38:14 PM] Devin Peltier-Robson: I'd love to have it sooner, and I'm sure you're excited as well, but it's a part of a pretty big move as we integrate the first Pokemon site into the Curse network. I'm confident it will be worth it in the end. :) [6/21/2012 11:38:40 PM] Wattz: Sounds reasonable. : ) [6/21/2012 11:38:52 PM] Sabrina M.: Beyond excited =d [6/21/2012 11:38:52 PM] Cameron/KPZSR1: Sounds legit. :3 [6/21/2012 11:38:57 PM] Devin Peltier-Robson: I know that I, for one, am very excited to have the Marriland Forums upgraded to a new system, because the old one is slow as tar and really inefficient, haha [6/21/2012 11:39:00 PM] Cameron/KPZSR1: Not in a sarcastic retort either. [6/21/2012 11:39:00 PM] Sabrina M.: too legit to quit [6/21/2012 11:39:21 PM] Devin Peltier-Robson: Sounds legit in a legit way [6/21/2012 11:39:34 PM] Devin Peltier-Robson: Legitly legit

Jazzi 04:24, June 23, 2012 (UTC)

For the life of me I can never understand why anyone would move to a personal wiki-like entity over the real thing? 16:49, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * Curse is a wiki-farm as well. And clearly you haven't read the forum, because if you did you wouldn't be asking that. This is about moving, if you have no input to provide, please do not respond. Jazzi  16:52, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * I read the first couple but it is just a peeve of mine to see Wikias die off. Will read the rest then.
 * I am not sure what a wiki-farm is but anything other than a Wikia is just a wiki-like entity. 19:28, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

The point is Wikia is straying to far from what an encyclopedia is. And no, these features cannot easily be disabled.
 * I see that the above is the reason to move, but as an old Wikian I can feel the same that all these newfangled features are unnecessary and can even be a bother at times. At the Adventure Time Wikia users actually thought that the community was what the Wikia was about and got so angry when there was a mass younger than thirteen year olds bannings due to the rules being what they are but they learned that it is about information and the community is only there on the side. Those features can be disabled easily enough, even the visual based editing mode (which I tried to get people for removing on the Adventure Time Wikia), the only feature I saw spoken of that seemed like you couldn't get rid of was chat and possibly PlayQuiz? I couldn't tell if you could remove that or not. Anyways it seems a tad silly to move to a knock off site just because you gave up trying to remove some things?
 * Keep this in mind, not only will you be losing your Wikia, you will also be losing your identity and just become someone else (Marriland). 19:41, June 25, 2012 (UTC)


 * I like how Wikia says to work with the community to discuss things, yet that rule doesn't apply to them and would just put unnecessary things in a wiki (like adding PlayQuiz without us discussing if we want it or not). I also feel that moving off Wikia just doesn't seem right. However, I felt that this wiki is missing a lot of things and is also disorganized; it's one reason I joined this wiki. I wouldn't have joined otherwise if this wiki was in better condition (as I only tend to help with wikis that need help).
 * We would lose our traffic, and we would have competition between the new wiki and this wiki, along with the largest Pokémon wiki (Bulbapedia) I've seen. I supported the move so that we may have a fresh start with organizing a page and the community. Why a fresh start? Well: if I wouldn't go here for Pokémon resource since it's missing quite a bunch and disorganized, I doubt others will go here as well; I can barely locate some of our policies, and I'm an admin; and finally, some of our templates resemble those of Bulbapedia's (and that has bothered me since) - it would be nice to be different from them.
 * I might have more reasons, but I cannot think and am also hungry. :P Can't think with an empty stomach!
 * I am just saying that if I want info on Pokemon I will be more likely to go to The Pokemon Wiki over Marriland... I don't even understand what a Marriland is?
 * What templates do you need remade by the way? I could try my hand at them. 20:24, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

I am not sure what a wiki-farm is but anything other than a Wikia is just a wiki-like entity.
 * "Anything other than wikia is just a wiki-like entity". You don't know what you're talking about if you don't know what a wiki farm is. We're moving to get a fresh start. You can stay, but we're going to move. And we're not an individual, we're a subdivision of wikia. This forum shows I'm not the only one sick of this crap. Jazzi  20:30, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

I say that we move on the day when the English language Black and White 2 are released.
 * Anything other than a Wikia is just a wiki-like entity though? Just a knockoff. You still haven't explained why just disabling these minor issues isn't an option. 21:36, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * Anything other than Wikia isn't a wiki-like entity. If it's a wiki farm it is a wiki-farm whether or not it is on wikia. And it's explained in the beginning of the discussion. They're minor now, but they'll be more. They are just going to install more pointless features. Some aren't optional. "We're supposed to be a Pokémon Encyclopedia, not a social networking site. With this PlayQuiz thing, Chat, Badges and blogs (which we've disabled), top 10 lists, and message wall we're becoming a social networking site, not an encyclopedia." Now, if you continue to say "Anything other than Wikia is just a wiki-like entity" I'm going to have to ask that you do not respond in this forum any longer. And as I said a few posts up, If you want to stay, you can, but we're moving. Jazzi  21:58, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * You keep ignoring what I am saying? I asked what is wrong with just disabling the newfangled things you don't like and that are you aware that you will lose your self in a merge and become something that doesn't sound applicable to the subject (Marriland). What upcoming features do you think aren't going to be able to be disabled? 13:37, June 26, 2012 (UTC)


 * Cutting in for a sec: felinoel, Marriland isn't irrelevant to the subject of the wiki, the entire site's content is about Pokémon. There's nothing wrong with moving to that site hosting. Chaos  Void  18:42, June 26, 2012 (UTC)


 * No..? You are only reading my recent post on the matter, what I said when I was telling Jazz she was ignoring what I was saying. Here I will quote my original post.

I am just saying that if I want info on Pokemon I will be more likely to go to The Pokemon Wiki over Marriland... I don't even understand what a Marriland is? 20:24, June 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 19:08, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

If we're really going towards the move, then might I suggest planning how we can organize the wiki, such as how images should be named. We can probably discuss this on another forum.
 * Sorry if I have no place to edit this forum, but what would be left of this wiki when everyone leaves to the new wiki host? 15:17, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * From what I've seen before in other moves, everything. 15:20, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * So all the content will be left here? Will the current admins continue to be admins here? 16:24, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * Technically, but I doubt they will be active. 18:08, June 26, 2012 (UTC)


 * @Technology Wizard: They definitely won't be admins anymore, since they're gonna be completely inactive on this wiki after the move. The only admins will be the ones that are appointed after the move.
 * @Bermuda: Maybe something like the coordinated image names we have right now for the sprite images, just that on the new wiki, every image is going to be coordinated like that in some way to be able to find images more easily. Chaos  Void  18:42, June 26, 2012 (UTC)


 * Oh, I was under the impression it was a complete abandonment, my apologies for the misinformation then Tech. 19:09, June 26, 2012 (UTC)


 * Though, I'm unsure what's to become of this wiki after the move. For example, I think that the Kingdom Hearts Wiki, after moving, made their Wikia version much more fanon oriented, becoming more lax in their policies and allowing more fan information to leak onto their articles, so as to not create competition with the main site. We could do that on this wiki after the move and also allow Wikia's social features to become activated, such as chat, blogs, and message wall. Chaos  Void  19:22, June 26, 2012 (UTC)

I still don't see the issue here, over at the Adventure Time Wikia and the Warehouse 13 Wikia people, started treating them both like a place for fanon and social media but eventually (and with a dedicated admin crew) we got all of the social media and fanon pushed aside to the chat, blogs, and half of the forums (though that half doesn't get used anyways). Now, the Wikia is able to fully focus on being what it is, an encyclopedia. You don't like the newfangled features, that is fine, turn them off then. You can even get the visual based editing mode disabled if you want, warn users who try to use the site as a social media site and then ban them when they ignore your warnings, don't just run off and hide away under some unknown name that seems to be a random and chaotic mix of letters. 20:05, June 26, 2012 (UTC)


 * Jäzzi wasn't ignoring your argument, she was just telling you to stop arguing. The decision's been made, the majority approves, so what you're saying is really gonna make no effect at all on the decision. This isn't a forum deciding whether to move or not: it's past that point. Please, stop commenting on the forum if it's just to dissuade us from moving. Chaos  Void  20:43, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you Chaos. I have nothing more to say on that subject as it'll only bring trouble. Jazzi  18:56, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Just a little tip, make sure that you actually seek out the community's opinion. I've been in a move where it was mostly the admins who wanted to go and not everybody else. Things quickly fell apart from there. If people don't say anything, than ask them directly for their opinion. Use a bot if necessary. I'm mostly seeing the same names here, and assuming things haven't changed since I left, there are lots of users. You WANT their opinion. The MarioGalaxy2433g5  { talk /contribs} 22:43, June 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * The problem is, the majority of the users here don't really know what they're doing, so they wouldn't really have a clue about moving. Jazzi  18:56, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

[6/27/2012 3:50:33 PM] Paweł Ausir Dembowski: I'm pretty sure we'll be able to move the wiki in the next couple of weeks Since we're dwindling down to the final bits of the merge, we need to figure out what we're going to do. With images, videos, pages, and what not.

We are going to be affiliating with WikiDex, who is moving as well. They will not be on the same domain as us, but we will be affiliated. Jazzi 19:00, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Brainstorming
This section currently is only to talk about the content part of the wiki. We'll discuss adding administrators to the new wiki and to the old one once we sort this out. It'll occur a few days before the merge so we're prepared.

Please bullet  your posts.

Images

 * I find it'd probably just be best to get new images and reupload those. Get the in-game images on our own. Stop taking from Bulbapedia.

Image Naming

 * I personally feel images should be named as such:
 * Characters
 * File:Character (Full Game Name).extension
 * File:Character Artwork (Full Game Name).extension
 * File:Character Sprite (Full Game Name).extension
 * File:Character (EPISODE CODE ONLY).extension
 * File:Character (Manga Series and Volume Number).extension


 * Anime
 * File:Epiode Code- Full title of episode 01.extension
 * With 01 being exchanged for each number the image is.


 * Pokémon
 * File:Pokémon Name (Full Game Name).extension
 * File:Pokémon Artwork (Full Game Name).extension
 * File:Pokémon Sprite (Full Game Name).extension
 * File:Pokémon Name (EPISODE CODE ONLY).extension
 * File:Pokémon Name (Manga Series - Volume Number).extension


 * Games
 * File:Full Game Name (Box Art).extension
 * File:Full Game Name (Title Screen).extension
 * File:Full Game Name (Gameplay).extension


 * Manga
 * File:Manga Series - Volume Number (Cover).extension
 * File:Manga Series - Volume Number (Chapter Number).extension

Pages

 * Import them? Or start all over?

Videos

 * No thank you.

Special Extensions

 * Perhaps get a blog feature enabled only for a group of people with a right called "Blog Poster" or something.

Names

 * MarriDex
 * Marriland Wiki
 * Wiki Marriland

Templates

 * I personally like the sleekness of the round corners, but since Pokémon Wiki (this one) has round corners, and Bulbapedia has round corners, I think we should come up with something else. Or at least try something new.